Mekkorák vagyunk már???

Hozzászólás-megjelenítési lehetőségek

A választott hozzászólás-megjelenítési mód a „Beállítások mentése” gombbal rögzíthető.
1
Kuku képe

Úgy pörgött a nyelved,

Úgy pörgött a nyelved, hogy a pártemberek pislogni sem tudtak...
"... na nem 10 ezer milliárd dollárt, vagy csilliómillió km kerékpárutat kérünk, hanem jól átgondolt megvalósítható csomagot hoztunk..."
...és ez így ment végig :)))

2
tkacsa képe

ha nem

ha nem olvasnam,elsehinnem:)
Na ezt nevezem...!
Gratula:)
me'gegy cm-nel is sokkal,de sokkal tobbet er!!!
zsirjooooooooo:)!

3
pedro képe

Hello, my name is Pedro and

Hello, my name is Pedro and im a portuguese guy living in BP,im a big suporter of the critical mass, and the use of the two wheels transportation(without engine) ,but... i dont understand why is there always the police escort in the critical mass events,if anyone can anwser this to me.... it would be nice.
and about this last event in the 2006.03.11 why did we only whent to 3 political parts? And the others?? I know that they are not so big but dont they have a campain program?

thank you all.
(sorry about the english)

Pedro.

4
pixel képe

Pedro, these demonstrations

Pedro,
these demonstrations are only allowed with police escort, without that it would be illegal. To tell the truth, considering what some motorists in Bp are like, I am feeling better when the police secure the route. TDV went to the 4 major parties. There are a lot of smaller parties but there is almost no chance for any of them to get into the Parliament, so practically there is not much sense in lobbying at them. An activist of a green aprty (Élőlánc) came to grab a package to our meeting place, nevertheless.

TDV was quite international, I was with an american guy, and also heard several foreign-language guys. The American guy was simply overwhelmed, he couldn't imagine the same with 26 000 people :))

5
pedro képe

Hey pixel thanks for the

Hey pixel thanks for the anwser.. :O)

But thats why there was the arrests of bikers and their bikes, in the CM in NYC because a critical mass is "not supose" to be organized. And thats also why your american friend was amazed because a CM in NYC has like from 500 to 1000 people.
Because its done without police escort.
I was there in the 26.000 people CM in BP also, and it was amazing ,really, but there was the police.
26,000 people can do the same without the police escort.

About the political parts,isnt it good also if they have in there programs (even if they are a very small parts) the same promises as the big parts, concerning the bike culture in Bp? Because i think it will create a reaction on these 4 parts who are in the parlament, to look again to these issue.

Pedro

6
magwas képe

In hungary, tha "main"

In hungary, tha "main" critical mass events are well organized and legal, hence escorted by police. Nevertheless we are used to do other events, approximately once a month. We call them sightseeing tours, as demonstrations have to be told to the police in advance. However on one of the last tours the cops escorted the tour an made videos. We will release these videos as soon as we are ready with putting appropriate music (for example the song titled "Brig Brother" from the band called "URH";) under it, an mask out the face of those whose consent we could not obtain.

Of course both sides know the meaning of the expression "critical mass", and we all know why these tours are done. We have choosen to keep things completely legal; even on "small" CMs we make a point of adhering to all traffic rules. But we choose routes where ridiculousness of some rules came obvious;) We keep cycling absolutely legally, and make a noise at the first attempt to stop us doing that.

I personally think that it is very hard to organize absolutely classical CMs, where "no one organizes", and things which not compliant with traffic rules do happen. And also it would give a bad PR.

Well, and keep an eye on "radical walkers" as well. They also do nice things, and they are beyond trying to negotiate with police;) Tried it, didn't work. Unfortunately they keep rather low profile on what they will do and when, but I am sure that it will be very cool.

About politics: there simply wasn't other way to keep it separate from party politics an under 200km long.

--
a bátor kommutátor

7
prof.gruppetto.hu képe

It's always nice to hear

It's always nice to hear about foreigners joining us. :)
There are so many small parties without a chance to get into the pairlament that it wouldn't be possible to visit all their offices.
So the organizers decided to visit the 4 major parties (who are already in, and have a chance to get in again.) The smaller parties were also informed about the event, and they were invited to the starting place to get the package we were promoting. Sadly, only one of them came. (They are called Élőlánc (means Living Chain) and they're a kind of green organization.)

8
RoGeR képe

I think a real BIG and

I think a real BIG and ILLEGAL Critical Mass in Budapest wouldn't be so successful.
We want safety on the roads (and some other things). If we demand this in an illegal form the goverment would say "No way".

9
tody képe

valaki összefoglalná a

valaki összefoglalná a dolgot?
mert pedro szavait fordítottam, de a többihez lusta vagyok. ;)

10
prof.gruppetto.hu képe

Yeah, it's important to be

Yeah, it's important to be as legal as possible for PR reasons. We don't want to be a target of hatred from drivers, pedestriants and users of public transportation. We want understanding and cooperation, not street war. Of course, this is a kind of revolution, but we are trying to make it as peaceful as possible. :)
These are my personal thoughts, I hope it is close to the opinion of the organizers. (And as this is in fact a self organizing event, I suppose I'm one of them in a way, altough I'm not wearing the "official" t-shirt :)

11
pedro képe

ok.. As i can see this is a

ok..
As i can see this is a cultural issue,i realize that "the hungarians" or do it illegal or very legal, i think its no problem,but when we talk about CM witch is something that existed already before made in Hungary, I think that there is some aspects that have to be followed. Otherwise its not called Critical MAss but, Cooperation Mass.

BUT... Of course its just my oppinion.

thx all for the replys.
sorry but my hungarian is still not so good to write all of this.

Pedro

12
magwas képe

It is not because we are

It is not because we are afraid of civil disobedience. We just think doing it legally is more effective in these circumstances.

You are right that Critical Mass is not an exact name in some senses. But if you interpret the expression as "doing cycling marches for our rights", our CMs are the best ones;)

--
a bátor kommutátor

13
pedro képe

NIce sentence... Im not

NIce sentence...

Im not acusing you guy/girls of anything,even because i also live here and i also fight for this.
I just wanted to know some opinions about this issue, and now there is alot of opinions and its hard to talk with 1 person at once.
Doing it legally its "always" efective,but still when there is a CM like this last saturday, there is a big feeling of power among the bikers, because of the police escort,because we can go in streets that they will never go (unless they are a bike messenger), because the roads are close just for the bikers, and so on... Then the bikers attend to be very agressive towards the car drivers,like it happen in the beginning of Rakotczi ut. A car that was coming from Sip utca come to the middle of the bikers and 1 of the "orange shirts of CM" stay in front of the car, this was just in front of me, the women inside was trying to explain to the guy that she was going to turn in the next on the right, but the guy dint care about what she was saying, the guy was screming so much with HER that she was coming out of the car to beat him ,but he closed her door ,almost in her head,and then the bikers who were passing and seeing the situation were stoping and getting around the car, of course the women was getting afraid and stop.what i want to say with this ONE example is that why aren't the bikers they agressive also in the other days??
why it has to be under police escort and with 1000 people(minimum).
And why is there a need to be agressive with the car drivers?
Is it supose to be a pacific demonstration?

And this is just 1 example, I'have been in almost all the CM in BP and I have seen some other things like this.

14
magwas képe

I haven't seen this

I haven't seen this accident, but I can believe it. I think that it has nothing to do with the legality or illegality of the event.
Simply when there are so much people, there bound to be some assholes as well. I can't think of a solution. It could just have been mitigated with good communication.
Moreover I think that people on illegal CMs feel much more the "fuck the police, fuck the cardrivers" feeling, which would lead to more incidents.

--
a bátor kommutátor

15
whitehawk képe

Csak mint általában!

Csak mint általában! :D

Jó volt titeket viszontlátni. (Már akikkel találkoztam korábban :D Akiket először láttam azoknak is örültem persze.)

Politikusban nem bízom, de azért kiváncsi vagyok mi lesz.

16
Fjoe képe

Hi All! Szerintetek nem

Hi All! Szerintetek nem lehetne olyan Video-t csinalni ami a CM-ről szól és le lehetne adni a TV-ben (akármelyik) tudjátok mint a társadalmi célú hirdetések. Bár nem tudom hogy ez hogy működik csak 1 ötlet. Talán ez lenne a legjobb tájékoztatás az autósoknak. MÁR CSAK 40 NAP!!!
Voltam: Fjoe

17
grafitember képe

Nagyon nagyok

Nagyon nagyok vagytok!
Gratula!!!

Miközben nektek szurkoltam, hogy ne legyen semmi botrány, a Via Buenos Airesen belefutottam egy antiglobalista zavargásba. Kiégett egy divatüzlet és egy Mekdó, illetve három személygépkocsi, mire megjöttek könnygázzal a kékek.

http://www.corriere.it/Primo_Piano/Cronache/2006/03_Marzo/13/milano.shtml

A BMW tulaja, teveszőrkabátjára fittyethányva térdelt a füstölgő kocsija mellett és sírt. Hát, itt ilyen is van.
Nem bánom, hogy Budapest nem tart itt. Ne is tartson. Tudom, hogy off, de mellkasonb@szott a metafizikus kapcsolat egy civilizált demonstráció és a neobarbarizmus között.

A lényeg, hogy nagyok vagytok!

18
Kuku képe

Sinya ezt figyeld. Ez a

Sinya ezt figyeld. Ez a pálya csúcsa most jöhet a nyugdíj... :)

"A Tour De Voks valójában nem tüntetés volt, hanem egy kollektív és rituális kézbesítés. A menet szellemi kiötlői rendes jó biciklis futárokhoz méltó munkát végeztek, amikor végigmentek a négy parlamenti párt székhelyén, és ott az adott párt képviselőjének átadták "a pakkot"."

www.cspv.hu

19
boci képe

Mekkora látvány lenne, ha

Mekkora látvány lenne, ha egy nap 1200 biciklis futár tekerne Pesten :)

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...akrat icob, icoB

20
alla cool képe

Simán!Eljöhet még az az

Simán!Eljöhet még az az idő, mindenesetre nem árt erre"gyúrni",nem elképzelhetetlen sztem egyáltalán.
Most mennyi futár mukodik amugy,
tuggya vki?

21
boci képe

hajtipajti oldalán az áll,

hajtipajti oldalán az áll, hogy ők 130-an vannak.

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...akrat icob, icoB